Topic: The Legend Of Zelda: Oracle Of Hours (April Fools' 2008 Project) - Brainstorming Topic

[JonLeung]

Hello?  Anybody here?  >_<



Just throw out concerns, comments, anything.  If this doesn't work I want to know if we can fix it or what other projects, if any, to consider.



TerraEsperZ said:

It's definitely interesting, but it will require a great deal of work to appear in any way believable. By that, I mean that dungeons will need to seem "solvable" for example. Also, the difference between night and day will have to be more than merely aesthetic, and actually affect gameplay in some way. Plus, if we want to go the extra mile, we'll have to come up with at least a few original tiles, as well as original bosses requiring moderate GBC-style pixel drawing skills. All in all, a big challenge, but definitely interesting.

All of those concerns considered.  Or at least, I myself am ready for those eventualities.

[Revned]

Well, the more I think about it the more work I think it would take. I wouldn't be likely to do a lot, I have other projects I'd rather work on. At this point, I think we should save this for another April. There hasn't been a lot of activity on the boards, so it would probably be a small team. 14 weeks with 3 or 4 people isn't enough.

[marioman]

I like the idea.  Although I have no skills to contribute toward it.  The only recommendation that I have is that it probably shouldn't be too much like Boktai.  IMO, a day/night oracle game should resemble the others more than it does Boktai/Castlevania.  Good luck.

[TerraEsperZ]

I'd be interested, but like Revned, there are way too many projects I'd prefer to finish instead.



---

"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably." [...] The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. - Captain Jean-Luc Picard



B*tch, meet reality. Reality, meet b*tch. - Me

[JonLeung]

I honestly think it would be substantially less work than MMSX:GotM.  A lot less.  If we decide to do this particular project (which becomes more likely if no better ideas come soon), however many of us there are, it should work.  Even with only, say, three people (geez, I hope not) it should be easier than MMSX:GotM.  There are some details to work out, certainly, we want things cohesive and realistic, but there are not as many particulars as in the last one.  Actually, perhaps it might work better with a small team, just as long as they were dedicated.



When I hit my Christmas break I'll try to churn out an original dungeon to see if it's as easy as I imagine it is.  Probably something like the Clockwork Temple that I proposed, which will include original tiles for the Spinner gear sockets and the Spinner rail tracks (and since as far as I know you guys haven't played Twilight Princess yet, you probably have no idea what I mean).



The more I talk about this, the more I like it, but I'm probably scaring you guys as I'm not feeling the good vibe returning.  But if that's really how you feel then I can't force anything upon you.  I hate to constantly compare to MMSX:GotM but I believe this should be an easier pill to swallow than that.



If it honestly turns out to be just me, I can live with that.  I did at least half the work or more on the last two, and I can see myself doing a lot on this one.  But if it is just me, expect me to prod some of you guys very often for feedback, since the surprise is already ruined for you guys anyway.  



And if Revned and Terra use "there are other projects to be worked on" as a reason (it IS valid), then I fully expect Castlevania: Symphony Of The Night, Castlevania: Harmony Of Dissonance, and Treasure Master all nice and complete before April!    TREASURE MASTER!

[Revned]

No, I really think it would be a lot more work if we wanted it to be convincing. People know Zelda, so they'll know right away when they look at the maps that they're just palette shifts unless we really make an effort to make new dungeons with completely new rooms and puzzles. Let's be realistic, if you put a lot of thought into each room, it might take 15 to 20 minutes total per room. Multiply that by about 35 for one dungeon, multiply that by 8 for all the dungeons, and you get 70 hours of work, not even considering the overworlds.

[JonLeung]

At least it's not 70 hours explaining the concept.    I question your estimate of time but I still think we spent more time total on MMSX:GotM.  I know it took me a sizeable fraction of that just doing the boss sprite edits!  And I made four stages.  I could've easily put in 70 hours alone for that, and a lot of that was conceptualizing.



Okay, I can see that this appeals to mostly just me at the moment.  Or rather that I'm the only one that thinks its doable.  But we still have until...let's say, Christmas is the deadline, to actually decide what the April Fool's project will be.  I don't want to lose what should be a VGMaps.com "tradition".



Look at me run off with RT 55J's idea like a psycho.  >_<



So then I pose the question: what kind of project do you think would be worth doing, and easy enough, or at least worth the challenge?

[RT 55J]

I personally think that OoH would be feasible and worth doing. AFAICT, the biggest problem is that two of our better mappers have other (and more important imo) projects to do. However, I'm convinced even a team of 4 mappers could do it. I might even be able to make a 'sample' map before Christmas.



...am I sounding overly optomistic.

---

Dot? Dot. Dot!

[JonLeung]

If by "two of the best mappers" you mean Terra and Revned, then I agree.  Now don't let it go to your head, guys.  



But perhaps they feel like they'd rather do something they think would be more appreciated, or that they enjoy doing more.  And that's fine, as they don't owe VGMaps.com anything.  If anything, it's the other way around.



Enough sucking up.  As a selfish web site owner, one of the reasons for hoping for a project that's big enough to be seen as a huge gaming hoax that will be remembered for more than a day is for an increase in site traffic.  And a project is the only time I dare give myself the Maps Of The Month honour.



I guess I'm already sold on this idea.  If by Christmas nothing better comes along, I'm going ahead with it, even if alone.

[TerraEsperZ]

Okay, I'll bite. I actually really like the idea, but I don't want to feel trapped with having to do  a large amount of work in a short amount of time like you guys did last year. That's why I'll commit to at least one dungeon, *maybe* two, and we'll see about the overworld.



The overworld is really the major part of the project, and to me the most exciting to do but also the most difficult one. It needs to be interesting and varied with some logic to its layout.



Another thing to consider on the project is that all 3 sets of colored Game Boy maps so far have entirely different sets of colors. The colors in Link's Awakening DX are much paler than the other two, and even then, thanks to differences in the versions of the emulator used, Seasons' palette is brighter than Ages' which looks more solid. Getting some kind of unified color palette or color type will be tricky.



---

"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably." [...] The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. - Captain Jean-Luc Picard



B*tch, meet reality. Reality, meet b*tch. - Me

[Revned]

I feel kind of the same as Terra, I don't want to get in over my head. Count on me doing one dungeon and part of the overworld. I might do more once the ball is rolling, but we'll have to see.

[JonLeung]

Awesome.  Thank you, thank you, thank you.    I suppose we might as well start the ball rolling.  I'll figure out where to move this topic soon where it'll be hidden from most people.



Okay, here's what I was thinking.  We should start by figuring out the dungeons.  Then, based on the themes of the dungeons, we'd think up of what kind of area those dungeons would be in.  The overworld would be made up of those areas, of course.



Take a look at A Link To The Past's two worlds.  They are both essentially nine areas (though I have Death Mountain as two because of the way they are stored in memory, I guess), are those square areas are very distinct.  Yet in the overall world map, you see that there are natural progressions in between that blend the areas.  If that makes sense.  We could use a similar approach when constructing our world, whatever we call it.



The items acquired in the dungeons will determine the order of them, and also how they can be accessed.  The map should be made as a day map, then the night map would be a darkened map, but edited in several places for that nocturnal feel.



But first things first, the dungeons.  What do you think of my earlier suggestions?

[RT 55J]

For the most part, I think you ideas are pretty good. I wouldn't worry about overusing the day/night aspect, given the fact a day is much shorter than an age or season. The idea I'm most interested in the Beach Cave. With a some floodgates, you could make some pretty devious puzzles.



Here's another idea for a 'dungeon.'



Excavation Site



The Evil Empire-O-Death is excavating the buried remains of an ancient temple supposedly because an Unknown Power-O-Awesomeness lurks below and the Evil-Emporer-O-Death must have it. Play as Link as he sneaks around the camp, exploiting his infinite stamina to work around the workers' schedule.



The dungeon could have two levels; the ground and temple itself. It would probably be located off one side of the world map.



Potential items:

Shovel

Cloak of Invisibility



Boss:

Unknown Power-O-Awesomeness (obviously)

---

Dot? Dot. Dot!

[Zeric]

This sounds like fun and I would have liked to be on it, but I doubt I would be of any help. Good luck with the projct guys.



---

Current Projects: Akumajo Dracula (X6800) Wai Wai World (NES) Super Mario World (SNES)

[mephea]

just tell me what i can do and ill try my damndest to accomplish it.  I would like to actually be involved in this years joke  something that doesnt require the mastery of photoshop and mapping games with parallax backgrounds.  gimme something to do!